HTML markup of the whole template

luceos

neptronix Super unfortunate because i like this project a lot, but it just doesn't make sense to invest the time in one that is designed against hackability.

The whole concept of Flarum is to have a minimalistic core package - the framework. It's first and primary responsibility is towards extensibility. But it wants to do so in a secure and high quality way. This does require more knowledge of modern standards to get up to par with how things are done. But trust me to say that I faced the same barriers. I used to feel the same way years ago. As an autodidact developer understanding code never has come easily to me.

Even now, after over ten years of active professional PHP development, I still feel overwhelmed about JS frameworks like Angular, VueJS, Mithril and the likes. Though I seem to be getting better at them, most likely I'll never be able to meet the standards at which other developers play this game. It doesn't matter to me honestly, I love to learn and I love to soak up new things. As a seasoned developer I think it's also my responsibility to accept what I can't do and bring to the table what I can.

neptronix

luceos I have the same problem. I usually write things from scratch ( or prior code that i know and understand intimately ) and use a minimum of other people's code and the absolute minimum of structure unless the scale of the project is large enough to justify it.

I got my job by replacing 3 developers who tried to build the largest and most complex architecture with OPC ( Other People's Code ) and frameworks string together who all failed to rewrite our LMS.

1) Custom from scratch framework guy - i dunno what happened with him; perhaps he just realized he was over his head.

2) Codeigniter guy - this guy wrote everything in basic MVC and actually had 60% of the functionality implemented until he hit a wall when we wanted weird things that his components and routing style did not work and this would have required a massive refactoring.

3) Laravel + OPC guy - this guy was what coding horror dude refers as an 'architecture astronaut'. Thousands of classes that did very little, all strung together with OPC. Constantly talked down to me for not using frameworks or adhering to the latest buzzword. This guy built a chocolate easter bunny very quickly - shiny and delicious on the outside, but hollow on the inside. Only 10% of the functionality was built by the time he hit a wall with the level of complexity he built over 2 years.

So i inherited a massive project written in a 2004 style and refactored it over 2 years to work on php7.2, be more MVC, have mobile compatibility, scads of functions moved to a global function library, no more register_globals, etc etc.

I still don't understand the value of #3's approach, which is so common that it's an industry standard now. Not sold on it so i haven't bothered to learn it.

Pirat

Toby How do I properly add my css file so that it is the main one before everyone?
I will change it and that my design would change

luceos

Pirat you can add custom css (which in fact is LESS) inside your admin area under Appearance - Custom Styles. By using LESS you can override anything as well, without having to use !important on everything.

Pirat

luceos I found what you describe.
Custom Styles
Customize your forum's appearance by adding your own LESS/CSS code to be applied on top of Flarum's default styles.

As I understand it, it adds this data to the database.

Perhaps it is better to do what he would create a separate file in lib.
And the ability to create multiple custom css styles

I'm also starting to understand a bit of the engine, I see that the whole template is one css style

Pirat

luceos Custom Styles does not work

.ReplyPlaceholder {
display:none;
}
.PostStream-item {
display: none !important;
}
.Header-title {
margin: 100px;
}

I don't understand. Maybe I'm doing something wrong.

Pirat

luceos Error in this plugin is blocked this function.
"flagrow/upload": "^0.6.0",
https://discuss.flarum.org/d/4154-flagrow-upload-the-intelligent-file-attachment-extension

Pirat

I'm afraid of losing all the changes.

composer update

I don’t understand exactly how it works, but it’s kind of pulling updates and replacing all the files.

luceos

Pirat flagrow/upload is not yet compatible with beta 8 (or at least no version was tagged for it), either remove it or use dev-master at your own risk.

Pirat

luceos I will delete
I have another question how to change the text in the same way as CSS?
For example, I want to change the word Reply to the word Message

Is it correct to make changes here or is it bad?
vendor\flarum\flarum-ext-english\locale\core.yml

luceos

Pirat as a rule of thumb never ever edit any file in vendor. You can look at flagrow/linguist to force a specific string into a locale key.

Pirat

luceos Wouldn't it be more appropriate to change everything directly in the kernel to increase performance?
The only thing I do not know yet is how to update the code after this, the best option is that which I described before
https://discuss.flarum.org/d/17576-pull-your-github-changes
On the other hand, I do not want to create my own repositories, it is inconvenient and long
I will have to make any changes to my repository.
And it needs to be done every time so that I would not change in the core

luceos

Pirat with beta 8 you also have the ability to create a site/forum specific extend.php file which allows you to add overrides to core only meant for this forum. As said before, do not touch vendor, ever. It will bring you to your knees in the long run if you continue doing that.

Pirat

luceos I'm afraid that I need to do so much that I can't do without a kernel
most likely I will constantly work with the master branch

Toby

neptronix I still don't understand the value of #3's approach, which is so common that it's an industry standard now.

There must be something good about it if it's become an industry standard... Perhaps it's worth a little more of your time to keep an open mind and investigate the benefits?

Toby

neptronix Not to revive this discussion which I think has taken its course... but just a note for interest:

I was just nostalgia-reading through the old esoTalk blog and it seems back in 2011 I said almost the exact same thing as you:

I'm not a big fan of dependencies. When I make software, I like to have complete control and understanding over everything I'm working with—that's just the way I work as a programmer, I guess. Perhaps it's a flaw. Perhaps not. But for this reason, I chose not to use an existing PHP framework.

And then a short time later, as the sole maintainer of a piece of software powered by a custom pseudoframework, I wrote this:

So, what did I do wrong? To summarise it in a few words: I reinvented the wheel. Many times.

When I rewrote esoTalk, I wrote it from scratch, using no frameworks and no libraries. I wrote all of my own code to do things—database, MVC, session, JavaScript, etc.—when there was already code out there that was free, open-source, actively maintained, and most importantly, better.

Why did I do this? I had some kind of prejudice or bias against frameworks and code that other people wrote. I shallowly assumed that all PHP frameworks were big and clunky like CakePHP, and I didn't want to have anything to do with them.

neptronix

Toby I read what amazon would let me read, and a bit about the slim framework.
Seems like a decent book.

Then i saw performance benchmarks of codeigniter, laravel, slim, symfony, phalcon, and vanilla php.
I became embarrassed that i wasn't using phalcon already and really turned off by laravel.

I guess i'll go scamper off and have some drinks with the ASM forums guy... 🤣

Pirat

Toby Toby, why is the white screen loading in my mobile version?
Another second question. Maybe it is better to use template building via html instead of javascript.
I mean, this code is not convenient.

todo.view = function() {
    return m("html", [
        m("body", [
            m("input"),
            m("button", "Add"),
            m("table", [
                m("tr", [
                    m("td", [
                        m("input[type=checkbox]")
                    ]),
                    m("td", "task description"),
                ])
            ])
        ])
    ]);
};

it's just tear your eyes out

Happy New Year!

neptronix

Toby Thanks for getting back to me.

Interesting that you went full circle. Since this conversation, i read 'php the right way' in full, but i still have some objections to certain practices in modern php development. It may be due to a lack of experience with say, working in a team; thus not understanding the value of them.

My framework has not bitten me yet, but then again i am a single programmer working on a very large project.

I think the conclusion is that i don't understand working in a team, and should get to working with one ASAP if i want to continue to write code in PHP that others understand.

As for my choice of forum software for my big project, i've ruled out flarum for the time being, due to what it would require to patch on the functionality the community needs. But am still keeping an eye out on the project.

luceos

I think every developer reinvents the wheel at some point in his career. Whether that's a complete framework or pieces. We all believe depending on the code of someone else has more drawbacks than benefits. In fact my multi tenancy package way back was a custom php framework too and now it's "just" a package for Laravel. More powerful, more secure, less bugs, less maintenance and not reinventing the wheel, engine, fuel and car.

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